podcast-graphicTHE LOVING WITHOUT

offers interviews, lessons and insights on the subjects of polyamory and ethical non-monogamy. Our mission is to create more awareness and acceptance of these lifestyle choices through education, communication and the respectful exchange of ideas.

We seek to promote healthy relationships, tolerance and understanding – whether you are already living a life of ethical non-monogamy or are among those who are curious to know more. We love to create, share stories of courage and growth, encourage loving responsibly, and spread positive energy. So come join us!


Exclusive content & special offerings if you become a patron of this podcast.
Kathy Labriola Head Shot


Kathy Labriola is a nurse, counselor, and hypnotherapist in Berkeley, California. She has provided affordable mental health services to alternative communities for the past 30 years. She has been a card-carrying bisexual, polyamorist for 50 years. Kathy is author of “Love in Abundance: A Counselor’s Advice on Open Relationships”, “The Jealousy Workbook”, “The Polyamory Break-up Book: Causes, Prevention, and Survival”, and her new book, “Polyamorous Elders: Aging in Open Relationships”. She is extra crunchy, and lives in a housing cooperative, rides a bicycle, and raises chickens and organic vegetables.


Angie and Alan Thomas


On March 2, 2017, Alan Thomas stepped on his bathroom scale and panic set in. The number staring back at him read 304 lbs. His first thought was of him being known as Angie’s first husband as he would likely not live another 10 years. Second, all he would miss with their four children. Third, he also thought of all the future dreams he hoped to accomplish that would be cut short by his obesity.

Two hundred sixty days later, stepping on that same scale, Alan saw 175 pounds, which was his goal weight. Angie joined Alan and released 63 lbs. Their two personal journeys has led to the process known as “Rethink Dieting,” where Alan and Angie walk everyday people that struggle out of the self-made prison of overweight and obesity to unleash their potential so they can live the life they were born to live.

RELATED LINKS | Website | YouTube | Twitter | Webinar | Facebook

Joli Hamilton Headshot


Dr. Joli Hamilton is the relationship coach for couples who color outside the lines. She is a research psychologist, TEDx speaker, and AASECT certified sex educator. Joli is also the author of the best-selling book “Project Relationship: The Entrepreneur’s Action Plan for Passionate, Sustainable Love”. She has spent the past two decades studying and re-imagining what love can be if we open our imaginations to possibility. Joli helps people create partnerships that are custom-built for their authentic selves, no more shrinking, pretending, or hiding required.

RELATED LINKS | Website | Instagram | Book

Nate Hockstra Headshot


Nate Hockstra is an expert on helping men find a meaningful relationship without using any “pick up” or game playing. He has helped countless men find companionship and love for a lifetime. He is a former coach for Tony Robbins, has over 10 years experience, and has over 10,000 of coaching experience. He resides in San Diego with his lovely wife.

RELATED LINKS | Website | Facebook | LinkedIn

Cooper Beckett Headshot


Queer non-monogamous writer, Cooper S. Beckett began his writing career as a podcaster as host of Life on the Swingset: The Podcast and speaker in the sexuality education community, he wrote “My Life on the Swingset”, a memoir of his first five years in non-monogamy, then followed that up with two novels, “A Life Less Monogamous”, and “Approaching the Swingularity”. He lives in Chicago with Elle, his wife, constant, and binary star, Egon, their ghost terrier, and black cat Willow.

RELATED LINKS | Website | Twitter | Book | Podcast

Lyndzi Miller Headshot


Lyndzi Miller has been a sexual educator at The Tool Shed: An Erotic Boutique since 2012, and is their current assistant manager. She established the Milwaukee Poly Group in 2008, facilitating discussion and support group meetings every month since. She also hosts the bi-weekly podcast, Polyamory Uncensored, interviewing ethically non-monogamous folks on their polyamorous journeys. She is an avid knitter, a mother, a burlesque dancer, and a huge geek.

RELATED LINKS | Website | Twitter | Facebook | Book | Podcast

Luna Ray Head Shot


Luna Ray is the founder of Bloom Community. Bloom is a community hub centered on ethically non-monogamous, queer, kink, and creative groups and events. She serves on the board of OPEN, the Organization for Polyamory and Ethical Non-Monogamy, whose mission is to advance public acceptance and build political power for polyamory and ethical non-monogamy. Prior to Bloom, Luna led User Acquisition for Instagram from 700M to over a billion users, the social products team at Oculus that launched consumer VR to the world, and the Marketplace team at Faire. Luna has two degrees in engineering and business from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and studied computer science at Stanford.

Shai Fishman and Lea Aella Headshot


Shai Fishman and Lea Aella are the founders of Leveled Up Love, a thriving global Facebook community of over 7,700 open relators around the world seeking to create secure, fulfilling, and sustainable non-monogamous relationships. They are creators of the Secure Poly Collective™, a heart-centered support program for conscious open relating with exclusive live events each month, coaching with the best in the industry, and an array of tools and resources. Through their coaching and group program work, Shai & Lea teach their philosophy of open relating called Eco-Amory™, an approach to free love that mindfully cares about the entire relationship environment and sets the stage for fulfilling, healing, and sustainably happy polyamorous relationships. They have appeared and spoken on “The Doctors”, “Leading Edge Love Radio”, Evolve Fest, Relate Fest, Enrich, One World Tantra Festival, and Sol Y Luna Festival.

Shai Fishman and Lea Aella Headshot


Shai Fishman is the co-founder of Leveled Up Love, a thriving global Facebook community of over 8000 “open relators” around the world seeking to create secure, fulfilling, and sustainable non-monogamous relationships. He is the co-creator of the Secure Poly Collective™, a heart-centered support program for conscious open relating with exclusive live events each month, coaching with the best in the industry, and an array of tools and resources.

In this episode, Shai and Kitty talk about Open Love Experience, a Platinum Level Retreat for Couples Curious About Consensual Nonmonogamy, inclusive of Transformative Relationship Coaching, Private Festival Performances, and an Unforgettable Erotic Evening. The event will be held October 13-17, 2022 in Fort Pierce, FL. Kitty Chambliss will be among the expert presenters at this unique and exclusive event!

RELATED LINKS | Open Love Experience  *Save $1000 when you use code: LWB1000

Jon Papernick Headshot


Jonathan Papernick is a novelist and short story writer. He teaches fiction writing at Emerson College in Boston where he has taught since 2007. “I Am My Beloveds” is his fifth book.

RELATED LINKS | Instagram | Facebook | I Am My Beloveds

Roger Morgan headshot


Roger Morgan is 27 years old. He and his wife are new to the world of polyamory/ENM. He is a former Conservative Evangelical and recently completed his Bachelor’s degree in Biblical and Theological Studies. He considers himself polyamorous by orientation.

RELATED LINKS | LWB Workshops | FREE Masterclass

Cee Blossom Headshot


Cee Blossom is a life coach who helps people feel more secure in consensually non-monogamous relationships.

RELATED LINKS | Website | FacebookTwitter | Instagram

Ashley Robertson Headshot


Ashley Robertson identifies as a feminine, ethically non-monogamous, doll. With over a decade of experience in the BDSM scene, she isn’t shy of perverse topics. She is a liberated educator who wishes to share with others the freedom of sexuality without shame. With three teaching degrees, she’s fed up with the idea that learning comes from a constrictive set of standards. Instead, she assumes innate curiosity in all people and crafts workshops and activities that invite introspection. She’s at her happiest when demonstrating consent with youngsters, guiding youth into comfort surrounding condoms, and answering questions about sexuality honestly. She facilitates her own version of the Our Whole Lives curriculum adapting the workshops to fit diverse audiences. This non-coercive, comprehensive approach to sex ed is what we all wished we had in high school.

RELATED LINKS | Website | FacebookFacebook Group | Instagram

Tanya Dotson-Winckler Headshot


Tanya Dotson-Winckler is the CEO and Founder of 180° Time Management™. She helps smart small businesses owners escape overwhelm, eliminate burnout and stop feeling trapped, without sacrificing their success!  She does that by showing them how to reframe their workday and leverage their time. Basically, she reframes time and sh*t.

RELATED LINKS | Website | Facebook | Twitter | YouTube

Laurel Schrock Headshot


Laurel Schrock, a network engineer for Verizon Communications, hails from Mount Vernon, NY. She’s an Army Vet, a graduate of Georgetown University and also a small business owner, making her love for candles into what she calls a “hobby that now pays for itself.”  Laurel has always identified as monogamous but a little over two years ago, she began dating an awesome guy who happened to be poly.  Earlier this year (2021), she began to experience intense and debilitating insecurities. Although it was gradual, she was struggling and she knew she needed help. Laurel had an amazing breakthrough recently in discovering and embracing who she really is. She now does not see herself as a monogamous person any longer.

RELATED LINKS | LWB Workshops | FREE Masterclass

Marie Thouin, Sharon Flicker, and Michelle Vaughan Headshot


Dr. Sharon M. Flicker is a clinical psychologist who researches intimate relationships, most recently focusing on consensual non-monogamy and love languages. She is licensed to practice psychology in NY and PA and is an Assistant Professor of Psychology at California State University – Sacramento. Dr. Flicker currently serves as the co-lead of the Inclusive Education initiative of the American Psychological Association’s Division 44 Committee on Consensual Non-Monogamy.

Michelle D. Vaughan, Ph.D. is a white, cis, pan, queer, able-bodied, polyamorous psychologist and an Associate Professor in the School of Professional Psychology at Wright State University. She serves as the Executive Director of PolyColumbus, a co-lead within APA Division 44’s Committee on Consensual Non-Monogamy and an editor and co-author of The Handbook of CNM Affirming Mental Health Practice from Rowman & Littlefield.

Marie Thouin, Ph.D. is the founder of Love InSight, a mindful dating & relationship coaching practice where she helps people of all backgrounds design intentional love lives. Marie completed her doctoral dissertation on compersion in consensually non-monogamous individuals at the California Institute of Integral Studies. She also serves as Editor at the International Journal of Transpersonal Studies, a leading peer-reviewed publication in the field of whole-person psychologies.

RELATED LINKS | Sharon’s website and Twitter | Michelle on Twitter | Marie’s business website, her compersion website and her Instagram.


      • I would love the chance to interview, Kitty. You have a way of drawing out ideas that I might never otherwise consider. Tonight it occured to me as I listened to part 2 pf the Michael Rios interview that perhaps I need to learn to more deeply love myself. After all, I preach that loving yourself is the greatest relationship you can have in life. I seek to empower others and help them see and realize their own worth. Then it occured to me that I am lonely and feel stifled if I can’t GIVE love to another. Michael spoke of others as vending machines for our needs. I don’t….didn’t…see them in that way, but I saw then that I need to BE that stand-alone, self-validating individual that I strive to help others become. My own growth and change is imminent now.

        • Hi Steven! I am looking forward to hopefully scheduling a podcast interview with you. Thank you for your kind and complementary words on my interviewing skills and methods of drawing out a great conversation from my interviewees. Michael Rios is one of my favorite interviews to date. I had the pleasure of seeing him present at Beyond The Love last year. So I did have a preview already of what he could bring to the table. His presentation called “Polyamory as a Spiritual Path” just blew me away when I heard it. And yes it was very much focused on loving ourselves so well that we don’t need to use other people as emotional vending machines. What a valuable concept that I carry with me to this day. I am so heartened to hear that this concept resonated with you too from my podcast interview with Michael. Go rock your personal growth, my friend! Yeah!!!

      • Wow, this has been so much fun to go from start to finish through these interviews. I’m in the middle of the most recent one now. So much knowledge and so much love. This is such a rewarding and valuable service you are providing.

        • Wow back atcha, Steven, this comment and sentiment rocks! I never knew I was someday going to be a podcast show creator. I have found it incredibly rewarding for so many reasons, including getting to talk to and gather knowledge from so many smart, compassionate and awesome people. I am thrilled that you are enjoying the interviews so much! It helps me to keep going!

    • Thank you so much for your kind note. I’m so glad that you like the podcast! It is alot of work but so rewarding. I’m enjoying it! Thanks for having such a beautiful and open mind, my lady friend! And THANK YOU for rating and reviewing it on iTunes. You rock! xoxo

  1. I was curious if you had any hints or tips on meeting poly folk? I moved to the lovely city of Baltimore not to long ago and finding others that are in the city has been an adventure. Most of the poly meet ups are out of the city limits – and me embracing the urban lifestyle no longer have a car! SHOCK HORROR! Are there any other places that folk gather online (i am newer to seeking out other poly folks) and plus – i would like to date girls (i am bisexual) but can’t seem to find any in my area. Maybe it is just a regional thing – but any tips would be appreciated.

    • Thanks for your comment! I don’t live far from you – in the Washington DC area. My best suggestion to you is the BmorePoly group (www.bmorepoly.org) in the Baltimore / DC / Nova region run by Barry and Cathy Smiler whom I’ve interviewed for the podcast. You can find their Meetup group here: http://www.meetup.com/BmorePoly. Other local groups and venues for events are Tabu, Bound, The Crucible and Entre Nous (though those are more on the swinger side of ethical non-monogamy).

      Another online community that you can check out is polyamorynetwork.com or also fetlife.com might be great for the bisexual side of you. They have forums there that you can join on any topic under the sun, including personals.

      I hope that helps! Let me know how you fair.

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